Dark Chocolate - From Bean to Your Health

Dark Chocolate - From Bean to Your Health

Chocolate has long been a favorite indulgence for many around the world, but how much do we truly know about it? From the history-rich cacao pods to the sophisticated science of chocolate-making. We are taking a voyage  into the world of dark chocolate: from bean to bar! We’re diving into intricate details of how chocolate is made, its ancient history, and the many benefits and considerations of this beloved treat. Sharing her insights is our guest, Netty Atkisson, a chocolate educator.

The Rich History of Chocolate

• Mesoamerican Origins: Chocolate's roots trace back thousands of years to ancient Mesoamerican cultures where it was considered a sacred food. The Olmec, Mayan, and Aztec civilizations all played crucial roles in integrating cacao into their daily lives, using it in rituals, as currency, and during important ceremonies.
• Introduction to Europe: With the arrival of Spanish explorers in the Americas, chocolate was transported across the ocean to Europe, initially reserved for the elite due to its high value. It wasn't until the Industrial Revolution that chocolate became accessible to the masses.

Chocolate-Making: From Bean to Bar

• The Art of Processing: The chocolate-making process begins with cacao pods, which are harvested, fermented, dried, and roasted. These steps transform the bitter fruit into a variety of chocolate flavors. Netty emphasizes the role of roasting and conching (agitating heat) which smoothens and develops the chocolate’s taste.
• Dutching: A Chemical Transformation: This process lowers the acidity of cocoa powder making it sweeter and darker, albeit at the cost of reducing beneficial polyphenols.

Nutritional Insights and Benefits

• Heart-Healthy Properties: Dark chocolate, particularly with a high cocoa content, is rich in antioxidants and polyphenols that may offer heart benefits. However, it’s essential to consume it mindfully.
• Choosing Quality Chocolate: Identifying high-quality chocolate involves checking for non-alkalized cocoa and minimal ingredients. Craft chocolate makers focus on quality, allowing for a rich flavor profile and nutritional benefits.

Craft Chocolate: The Superior Choice

• Get to Know Your Local Chocolate Maker: Visit craft chocolate shops to experience chocolate made with precision and passion. These chocolates often boast a more complex flavor, emphasizing quality over mass production.

The Journey From Bean to Your Health

From its beginnings in ancient civilizations to the shelves of your local store, chocolate has an incredible story. A journey enriched with cultural significance, complex processes, and modern-day science. Pursuing high-quality, carefully produced chocolate not only enhances the gastronomic experience but can also provide some health benefits. 

In the words of our guest, Nettie Atkinson, 

"There's so much joy in understanding and experiencing the art and science of chocolate." 

You can learn more about Nettie Atkisson on IG - https://www.instagram.com/the_chocolateconnection

And LI - https://www.linkedin.com/in/nettieatkisson

Whether you're a fellow chocolate enthusiast or just someone with a sweet tooth, there's always more to discover about this delightful indulgence. 

Dive deeper by listening to the full podcast episode for more intriguing insights and delicious inspiration.

00:00 Welcome and Episode Setup

00:55 Why Dark Chocolate Today

03:02 Meet Chocolate Educator Nettie

04:17 Netty’s Chocolate Origin Story

05:54 Cacao as Culture and Currency

07:11 Ancient Evidence and Trade Routes

09:56 Spain to Europe and Mass Adoption

11:31 Ceramic Vessels and Theobromine Clues

12:44 Cacao Pod to Nibs Explained

15:37 From Harvest to Chocolate Bar

17:51 Dutching Teaser and Next Topic

18:33 Van Houten Origins

19:34 Dutch Process Explained

21:12 Polyphenols Soil Terroir

24:04 Cacao Nutrition Compounds

26:35 Buying Better Chocolate

28:05 Tasting Ancient Chuncho

31:39 Craft Chocolate Movement

32:43 Book Workshops Farewell

🌟 🌟 🌟 If you liked this episode and would like to learn more about wellness training and workshops offered by 9 to 5 Wellness, email us at info@aeshathair.com. You can learn more about our programs at:  https://toneandstrengthen.com/workshops-trainings/. 🌟 🌟 🌟

My passion is helping organizations create a culture of wellness, and I do this by setting up health programs that prioritize the most important asset they've got – their employees. Cheers to a healthier and happier journey ahead!

🌟 🌟 🌟 You can learn more about ME- the host at https://www.aeshatahir.com 

 Follow me on IG and LI to learn more

https://www.instagram.com/tone_and_strengthen/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/aeshatahir/

Transcript

 Hello, everyone. How are you guys doing? I am doing fabulous. It is awesome. It's Thursday that we are recording it, and it's Thursday, June 18th. You know why I'm telling you this? Because today was Nick's championship parade, so the city is busy. Okay? And it's a hot day, too. And that being said, we are recording episode number 149 of the 9to5 Wellness Podcast. I can't believe it. We are almost at episode number 150. Like, oh, my goodness. Hmm. I am really looking forward to when we hit 200 episodes. So just 50 more to go. Anyways, that being said, I am super excited about the podcast episode today, and I know that you will love it, too. You know why? Because it's a sweet episode. You're like, "What? What? Are you telling me, other episodes are not sweet?" No, this is, like, literally sweet. Because we are gonna talk about everyone's favorite dessert, chocolate. We're diving into the health benefits of dark chocolate, like its antioxidant profile, the history of chocolate, and the science behind chocolate processing. Yes, yes, we are gonna get a little bit geeky. Not too much. Don't worry about it. And quality sourcing of chocolate. And also, we're gonna dive a little bit into, like, what are the main benefits of chocolate if it's done right? And the reason I wanted to talk about it on this podcast is because a lot of my patients, clients, even listeners have come back to me and they're like, "Oh, you're always talking about nutrition. You're always giving nutrition tips, but I have a sweet tooth, right? And at the end of the day, I want something sweet. Like, after dinner, I want something sweet, and I eat dark chocolate because that's what I've heard. It's very healthy for you. So what do you think about it?" And in all honesty, I told everyone, like, all my patients, everyone, I'm like, "Okay, if you are just eating, , one square of dark chocolate, you're good," till I attended a workshop. And then I was like, "Oh my gosh, I'll have to eat my words," because I was so wrong telling everyone, "Okay, if you eat just one square, it's fine as long as, you know, you're buying, like, dark chocolate and whatnot." Because today's guest- Is a person who actually taught me what- ... dark chocolate really is. I had no idea that I've been kind of, like, eating junk. Okay. So my guest today is Netty Atkinson. She is an author and a certified chocolate educator who leads hands-on chocolate tastings for corporate teams, leadership groups, and community organizations, and that's how I met her, at a workshop of hers where she was teaching everyone about chocolate, and I'm like, "Oh my goodness." Like, I had no idea chocolate can be that deep. So we are gonna go deep into chocolate with her today, and that's not all. I'm gonna... I wanna share with you that she trained with the International Institute of Chocolate and Cocoa Tasting, she completed a cacao masterclass in Dominican Republic, and she spent significant amount of time in Costa Rica deeply exploring chocolate-making process. Welcome to the podcast, Netty. Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here. And, like, just listening to the opening, I'm like, "I think we have to do two of these." Maybe. Right? Chocolate is just such a fun topic, and there's so much to talk about. Absolutely. And I know everything you wanna talk about, I'm thinking- I don't know if we can get all of this done today. This might need to be, this might need to be 150- 49 and 150. Oh, that would be awesome. I'm all, I'm down for it. Okay. So this is the question that has been, like, kind of on top of my mind since I attended your workshop, and we're gonna dive right into it, because I like talking to people about , what was the inspiration behind their business, and how did they get called to do this work, right? So you tell me, like, how did you get into chocolate, , literally learning more about it and then educating others about it? Yeah, I didn't grow up being that interested in chocolate. I mean, funny enough, my mom would bring us home really low-quality chocolate, and I just didn't really care about chocolate. And then I moved from New York to Chicago to the suburbs. I didn't know anybody, and I was looking for things to do, and, , I saw a lecture by a guy, he was a professor at Yale named Michael Coe. I didn't know who he was. I didn't really know what the lecture would be like, but I went there and my mi- it blew my mind. He is an expert in Olmec, , Mayan, other Mesoamerican cultures, and while he was there working, , his wife, Sophie, thought, "Wow, look at how people use cacao and chocolate in a daily life. I've gotta dig into this." So she started writing a book called The True History of Chocolate, and then sadly, she passed away from cancer, so he finished the book. But I saw his lecture, changed my life. I didn't know chocolate came from a fruit. I didn't know either and so 2001, so we'll talk about this more, but, And then I just was really impressed by the way it was a food and used in cultures for negotiations, meetings, dinners, just how it was valued, the food was valued, and that really stood out to me and put me on this course to dig deeper into- So- the history of chocolate and cacao ... so it was almost like a currency, used as- It had been used as a currency, so it was always high value- Wow ... and it was only for people that, it was for higher class, right? Even when it got to Europe. It was not until the Industrial Revolution that changed. So making chocolate is such a complicated process, and guess who was doing the work? Who was? The women. Oh. The women were doing all the work. Because it's said in one of the ancient codices, and I know we're jumping between history and... But in one of the ancient codices, , the records of the time, , it shows women working, pouring it to get froth. It also shows that after they finished eating, they would bring out lots of cacao drinks, some with magnolia, some with achiote, some with honey, some with vanilla. There was something called black cacao. I don't know what that is. White cacao. But they- cacao was special. It was not something you were gonna wash, your- Yeah your dinner down with- Yeah ... is what Michael Coe says. Yeah. It was special. It was venerated. And so people would sit after and they would drink it and enjoy it, and it was not easy to make. It's extremely difficult to make. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So now I'm excited- ... to get more into this. So let's talk about history, because- in your workshop you were talking about it, and I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is so exciting." I had no idea that this goes, thousands of years back. I thought that chocolate was, like, a, a more recent, when I say more recent, maybe a hundred years ago. And in some ways it is. The chocolate we know is, right? Okay. Yeah, invention, or a product that we started consuming now. , So tell us a little bit more about the history of chocolate, , and, you know, where did it all begin? So you gotta grab that vase right by you. Ooh. We gotta show everybody. This I just brought back from Ecuador. This is a replica of a drinking vessel that was found, , in Santa Ana La Florida, and it was in a burial site, the Moche Chache people. Yeah. So the way they can tell how long cacao has been around is from the alkaloid theobromine- And so we'll talk about that later, but theobromine is like caffeine is to coffee, theobromine is to cacao. They both have a little bit of each. But if you have a lot of theobromine and a little bit of caffeine, that tells you that was cacao. Oh. So they tested these vessels. Ceramics are incredibly important in the history of chocolate and cacao. And if you show people, that's supposed to be both one side is the jaguar and one side is a human. Oh, yeah. Yeah. You're right. And when I was in Ecuador- Yeah ... they told me that you could grab it- This is like the human side. This is like the animal jaguar. Yeah, yeah. In Ecuador in, , Monta- in Ecuador, they found it was 5,300 years ago. They can tell from the theobromine. There's also evidence of Peru 6,000 years ago in Huaca Monte Grande. The thing is, we think of Ecuador, and Peru as different countries now, but there were no borders. Yeah. They're six hours from each other. We know people were intermingling. Oh. In this part of the world, the trade networks were incredible, you know? Oh, yeah. We know the Incas had incredible trade networks. We know the Mesoamericans did as well. , Cacao made it up to New Mexico. It was being drunk in New Mexico. That's thousands of miles. So the trade networks were strong. What we... There's no evidence it was chocolate. They were probably drinking the fruit, maybe fermented. There's just no evidence it was chocolate. What really were the cultures that really brought what we know as chocolate drinks and that was in Mesoamerica. Those were the cultures that were making it when the Spanish arrived. So the Spanish arrived, and one of them said, "Ugh, it was a drink fit for pigs. It's terrible." Wow. Yeah. One of them, Bernardo de Castillo, he said, "Oh, you know, Montezuma drank 50 cups a day," because he used it for the women. , There was others, but they could see that it was venerated and it was important. So then what happened is when the Spanish arrived, they conquered, obviously, Tenochtitlan, land of the Aztecs, went down, took over the Mayans, and the cacao beans were brought back to, and the tradition of making the drink was brought back to Spain. , blender It's called a molinillo. Yeah? Yeah, that's their blender, right. Yeah. And I brought us little mini ones. This would be perfect for my protein shakes, right? Bring it in one day, and let's try it. No electricity needed. Even more sustainable. Yeah, I love it. I love that. Yeah, so chocolate made its way to Spain, and then the Spanish ended up, it spread through, Anne of Austria. It sounds like she's from Austria, but she was actually from Spain and brought it in to the court of Versailles, and then it just kept getting more and more popular. So that's how it s- started- Yeah ... spreading, globally. Yeah, and then Industrial Revolution, it still was pe- it was still for the wealthy. It was very expensive to make. It was like a luxury. It was expensive to get. Luxury item. It was luxury. It was luxury. The Industrial Revolution turned it into an item that we can all, that most people could afford. It was also used, , in pharmacies. I was just in, , I was just in, a few years , I was in the Czech Republic And in the Czech Republic, in the pharmacy, they had a cacao container. Yeah. So that was... They were used for medicine, and that's how the praline was invented. God. Niehaus is famous for the praline- Yeah and they were a pharmacy, and the son figured out, "Oh, if we put, medicine in the chocolate, the kids eat it better." Yeah. So that's how the praline was invented, and what, what Belgium is known for. Yeah. Yeah, no, that's wonderful. That's so wonderful. So I do wanna highlight you, something you said, and pre-interview we were talking about this- Yes vase. I was asking you, " what is it?" And you were like, "Oh, it's a vessel," and you got it from Ecuador, and you said that they used to hold it and run with it, right? Yeah, so I went to visit a chocolate maker in Ecuador, in Quito, and I was with a whole group, and we had the gentleman who makes them brought us several. We all bought a few, and then I shared one with the chocolate maker in Quito that's incredible, and she started crying, she was like, "This is the best gift." And she was telling me that they would have that, to be able to run with it. Hold like this, and then run with it. Isn't that amazing? Yeah, because the way it's shaped, like if you guys can see this, like closely, the way it's shaped, it's like almost like a handle, but then at the same time you can drink out of it. And they have some ancient pots too that were twist. Oh. They found the the Mayan symbol for cacao, was on a vessel they found that twists. , The Rio Azul vessel in,, Guatemala. So- Yeah the ceramics are key. Yeah. Like used in the history and to, like l- and to learn about the history. Yeah, and that's how we figured it out, that's what's telling us like if it's chocolate or not. Lots of theobromine, a little bit of caffeine. Oh, okay. Cool, cool. I was calling this a cocoa bean. Yes. And you said- And a lot of people do because Charlie and the Chocolate Factory called it a cocoa bean. It's actually called a cacao pod. So it's a pod. In Spanish, they call it a mazorca de cacao. It's a pod. Okay. And it's a fruit, and if we opened it up, , it would be... And of course I forgot to bring a knife. Don't worry about it then. But if we open it up- What's inside? You have fruit-covered seeds inside. Oh, wow. So it's called a mucilage or a baba. Baba in Spanish can mean- You know, slimy. It can even mean boogers. But anyway, so it means slimy and it is slimy. I will have children or adults try to touch the fruit of the cacao pod, and they are grossed out. Yeah. I would never- It tastes delicious ... place it. I would never place it on like a cacao, fruit, to be slimy inside. It's slimy, and it is delicious. I mean, it, you know, there's just, there's so many varieties of cacao, right? Okay. Just like there's a lot of varieties of apples. There are a lot of vi- varieties of grapes. There's a lot of varieties of durian fruit. There's a lot of varieties of jackfruit. Yeah. So there's a lot of varieties of cacao, and we're gonna try one of the most ancient, varieties- Yeah ... today. But inside is fruit. Okay. And inside the fruit, like most fruit, it has seeds. And so when the seeds are fresh, they call 'em... Usually they call 'em seeds. After fermentation, when they're no longer viable, people start calling them beans, so that's why they're called- So that's a bean ... cacao beans. So this is a bean. It's, that's a bean. And- Almost like a coffee bean, right? I have coffee beans here, too, yeah. So it's like a coffee bean. And then- Oh, look at that you crack off the shell. You get to pop it. You pop it, yeah. This is wild. And it's breaking a little bit. Sometimes I can get it in a clean shot. Yeah. But you take it off, and then these are the nibs. So some of you might be putting- Oh, it actually, kind of like now I can imagine that that's chocolate then you grind this down. Yeah. You know, you add sugar or milk if you're doing that, or you just grind it down if you're making 100%. Yeah. And you have the nib. You can actually eat it, like straight up? Yeah. Some people will eat with the husk. I don't like to eat the husk. They make husk, they make tea out of the husk. Oh. But yeah, so you like- Like any other kind of like seed or nut, like you just like crack it- Crack it ... pop it. . You can just eat it. And I'm sure a lot of listeners are used to seeing now cocoa nibs in the store. When I was growing up, that was not a thing that happened. Tell me more about it. No, I, I, I'm not aware of that. Are you not seeing 'em in the store? So because it is a superfood- Yeah ... because of the polyphenols, people are now buying bags of cocoa nibs. So it's just the beans crushed. Oh, okay. It's just the beans crushed, and putting 'em over smoothies or putting 'em in smoothies, putting 'em over parfaits to get that extra- Just like you do chia seeds and stuff, yeah like you do with chia seeds. Yeah. Exactly. Okay. No, I, I didn't know. Let's talk about the processing. Okay. And I know you just touched upon it a little bit, but tell me about the processing. How are we getting from the pod, like the pod on a plant, to like chocolate bar? Okay. Well, the thing about chocolate, which can make me sort of annoying sometimes, is there's never an easy answer about anything. But the standard process- Yes. Let's talk about that ... let's say the standard process, yes. I bet there are like million different ways to do it. Oh, well, you know, and it depends on where you are. But, but the fruit is, the fruit is harvested. Okay. It's cut open, and it's incredible to see, because the people that cut it open do it with machetes usually. Wow. And they're chopping it, and they're pull- and they're dumping it, putting it into piles. , It often then gets fermented. Hm. So it's fermented, and that is what gives it the chocolatey flavor. It creates lots of acids. The one that is most prominent when you smell it is acetic acid, which is vinegar. So you ferment, and then you, dry it, and then you, When the chocolate makers get it, they get the beans, they take the outside off, which is called winnowing. Okay. Forgive me, I got out of order. They roast it first. They'll roast it. Most chocolate makers will roast, some don't, but they'll roast it- Okay ... then take the outside husk off, which comes off a lot easier when it's roasted. It sanitizes it, and then it puffs it up. It makes it easier to remove that. Nice. Then it's ground down for on average three days, and then some people add a process called... So that's melanging. Some people add a process called conching, which is agitation, heat, and oxygen, which helps to further burn off the volatiles like acetic acid that were put in with fermentation. Okay. And then you are tempering it and putting it into a bar. So just simple, it's harvest, ferment, dry, roast, melange, conch, temper into a bar. Love that. Yeah. Wow, love that order. And yeah, I mean, I totally understand that it can be done, many different ways, it depends on where it's being produced, where, which country, which region you're in. That being said, though, you mentioned conching. The- I've heard of that A friend of mine, this is a question from a friend of mine- Yeah, yeah ... because we, I was just talking about, , your chocolate workshop with someone- ... and I was telling her, like, how I invited you to the podcast, and she's , "You have to ask her a question from me." And I'm like, "What is that?" She's , "Okay. I've heard of Dutching." Yes. Yes. So, and I don't, I really don't know where in the process it would come, but what is Dutching? Is it good for chocolate? If it's not good, tell us more because- Not good ... honestly, I, I don't know anything. , So there was a father and son. I actually have this... It was a father and son in the Netherlands, the Van Houtens. It might be Van Houten. I don't speak Dutch, but my son goes to school in the Netherlands. So I was there visiting him- Oh, nice ... and I found this at a thrift stop, and it's an old Van Houten, , container. Can I take a look? Yeah, and it's got some beans in it, but Ooh, look at this. Yeah. So that's the... So they are famous because the father invented a press- That could separate the cocoa butter from the non-fat solids in the bean. On average, half of a cocoa bean is cocoa butter, it's fat. It depends on the variety, it depends on the season, but on average it's 50%. So this cocoa butter is a vegetable fat. It is not... It's butter. Yeah. People say butter. Yeah. But it's not butter. It's... And so you press olives, you get olive oil, you press cocoa- Just like we make shortening out of, vegetables, right? Yeah. Yeah. So he figured out how to separate the- he figured out how to se- separate the butter. Okay. Which made it, for a lot of reasons they wanted to do it. But then his son figured out something called Dutch processing. They call it Dutch processing now. Okay. It's alkalizing the cocoa powder. When you press out the fat, you have non-fat cocoa solids, which often it's the powder, okay? Okay. So you get the powder. So he thought, "Oh, if we alkalize it, it is less bitter, less astringent, and it melts better in the milk." So it was used for the drinks. Ah. What it also did is give it... We have an example here. This is Dutched cocoa. Okay. It gives it a darker, richer flavor. So that, the darker one. And then people think psychologically, "Oh, that's better." It's not. This is a higher quality chocolate. Oh, look at that. It's gonna taste better, but they- I hope you guys can see this. This is so wonderful because I would've thought, the darker one is better. Exactly. And that's totally how we all would think. Darker, richer, and that's what he was promoting as well. It's darker, richer, it's gonna be better for you. It removes a lot of the polyphenols and the health by doing it. Oh. So by doing the Dutch process, yes, it might melt better in, , water or milk. It's not as healthy. It gets rid of the polyphenols. High temperatures in making your chocolate is not good. Wow High temperatures, no, not good. Yeah. So it's almost you know how they say if you cook at a very high temperature, especially like plants and vegetables, right? That it takes... It kind of like, gets rid of all the antioxidants. Yeah. So it's almost like the same concept. Yeah, it does. It's not good. And of course, for high quality cacao with high polyphenol, you also have to go all the way back to the soil. The soil is so important, and , one of the polyphenols in cacao are tannins. Yeah. And you think tannins in redwood trees are protecting the redwood trees from bugs. Yeah. And so polyphenols are the, I don't have to explain to you, but the superheroes, it's like the armor for plants. They can't get up and move, so they have polyphenols, these- Yeah ... phytochemicals that can protect them. Yes. And so when cacao is grown in bad soil, it gets stressed, it releases more tannins. So that cacao is going to be more bitter and astringent. So the soil, like wine, it's where it starts. Yeah. No, no kidding. Like, seriously. I love that. And I do wanna talk a little bit more about it. Let me just put this down. So I wanna talk about this, the process that you're just mentioning about, like, why the plants get phytochemicals, because they're trying to fight the environment. Like- Protect themselves, yeah it could be bad soil. It could be pests. It could be whatever, right? A- and we see this in diff- different plants like blueberries. Why are blueberries- Yeah ... and berries high in anti- antioxidants? Exactly the same concept, because the plant itself is trying to protect itself, and that gets transferred into the fruit. And then when we eat the fruit, we get, polyphenols, which are really, really healthy, and they're anti-aging, by the way. Talking about longevity here. So that helps the plant, but if we think about it, like I was thinking about it, I read it, read about it somewhere about, like, the berries, and then now you're explaining it, the same process is happening for, cacao too. We as humans, when we are in an environment where we are stressed, what do we do? We find defense mechanisms. Absolutely. Right? Yes. So the plants are no different. Yes. I have a friend who is, , floating around the world, for, to teach farmers about soil health and fermentation, and when I listen to her talk, the connections between human behavior and plant behavior and, you know, cacao in this, in this, situation, they are... It's, it's strong. The behavior between plants and humans. Yeah. Yeah. Isn't it? Isn't it amazing? Very similar. Every time I listen to her I'm like, "Oh, that's a life lesson." Yeah. That's, that happens in, with humans. For us too, right? As humans, right? Yes. Because when we are stressed, we are like, "Okay, now we have more..." We are expanding our capabilities. We have m- more armor, to protect ourselves. Yes. So that, that's what plant is doing too. So I always think, like, you know, it's, there are so many similarities. It's so good- So many ... to learn about. Yeah, 100%. Let's dive into the nutrition or the nutrient content of, cacao. I've read many different studies, and I'm gonna link some studies, , into the show notes, but this, very big study done at Harvard found that the polyphenol and antioxidant content of dark chocolate is very heart-protective. Like, it has benefits for cardiovascular health. And my audience knows that we're not making any health claims, , but just discussing the educational component, and this conversation is just for educational component. That being said, you tell me what else is associated with the, compounds that are found in chocolate. I might not even be bringing up all the compounds. You would know better. And what kind of health benefits are seen? They might not apply to everyone, but what are benefits seen? Yeah, that's true that they don't. You know, because it does get complicated with how many metabolize and everything. But with polyphenols, cacao is one of the h- the foods, if not the food with the highest. It is very high in polyphenols, and it's got flavanols, tannins, Several other polyphenols. Also, it has the the bliss molecule. Oh, okay. Only anandamide. Okay. And there's two foods that have it: dark chocolate and... Well, I should say cacao, and black truffles. But what's also in cacao, it's, it's a little bit, so I don't wanna overpromise this. It's a little bit, but it, also because the theobromine also helps your body not uptake, not process the, the bliss molecule, so it sticks around. , There's a study, William Liu, he was with Mark Hyman talking about that they did a study where it showed increase in stem cells, and people did have better cardiovascular after... I don't know his recipe. He was saying 70% cacao as a drink twice a day. It didn't say, 'cause dosage is everything, right? It didn't say exactly what is the dosage, but he said they did see those improvements. We know it is a vasodilator. I actually have a really funny story because I had a woman come to one of my classes and she said, "My doctor told me to eat dark chocolate, so I'm eating a lot of Snickers, but I just keep getting fatter." Well, you're eating Snickers, so yeah. Yeah. But the, the, I feel for her because the information about our food- Yeah ... is difficult to come by. And what is the truth, right? What is, what is the, what is truth? A lot of us don't know. So let's talk about it. Let's talk about it. If somebody goes out into the market and they're, like, looking for dark chocolate, healthy dark chocolate, what should they look at on the back of, like, the label? Okay, perfect. So first of all, make sure it doesn't say alkalized. Because if it's alkalized, that's the Dutch process. Yeah. So don't have that. The fewer ingredients, the better. All right? Got it. The fewer the ingredients, the better. The thing is, it's tough at grocery stores because, you know, certain grocery stores will have a craft chocolate area, others have a premium area, and sometimes even premiums like Lindt can have alkalized cocoa. So look at the ingredients first. I have a friend who is really smart guy. He's like, "A lot of times w- you don't know how it's grown." W- well, you do with craft chocolate, but he was saying you really gotta look at the balance, the length, like a fine wine, the balance, the length, the, intensity. He was saying, "Look at these..." You kinda gotta use your senses to figure out what, to figure out what chocolate is good because the polyphenols are what flavor. Mm-hmm. You know, in olive oil, like, a good polyphenol, full of polyphenol will make you chok- will make you cough. Yeah. And so, but I'm, feel like I'm talking in circles here because good dark chocolate doesn't have to be bitter. So many- When it's made well, it doesn't have to be bitter or stringent even though polyphenols do add astringency and bitterness. That's what they do. Got it. Got it. Okay. So you have, like, some bars here for us- I do ... to try. I do. So we are gonna close up with this trial, okay? So let's try. First, we have a hot chocolate, right? Yes. Okay. This is 100%. So this is how it would've been. 100% hot chocolate? This is so... Yeah. So this is, for thousands of years, chocolate was a drink. Not until around 1847 was it a bar. Oh. And the whole learning how to press out the cocoa butter was part of it becoming a bar. And they would drink it hot or cold. This is so different than... It has a little kick to it. I added chili, because a lot of times they would add chili, vanilla, honey. So I added a little chili for you to be surprised. Oh my goodness. This is, but this is delicious. Yeah, and I would say, No food in isolation is right. Yeah. But if you're going to choose the healthiest dessert you could have- Yeah it's dark chocolate, and I would say berries. Yeah, yeah. A- absolutely. No, this is good. Let's talk about this first one ... we have a really ancient, , we have an ancient variety called Chuncho. These two chocolate bars are made with an ancient heirloom cacao variety called Chuncho. Chuncho. I brought bars from two different makers because I wanted you to see that even if they're the same beans, the way chocolate makers make it- Hmm b- like, has the flavor vary. Yeah. So both of those are different. On the, on the, both sides have different. So that one is- This one is... They're both the Chuncho beans. And it's, it's from Peru. It's yum. And when you eat chocolate, because of the cocoa butter, like, take a lot of deep breaths, let it melt, and release its flavor. Cocoa butter melts at the temperature of our mouth. It's so good. Right? And then if you try the other one, it's the same beans- Mm-hmm ... but a different maker. Mm. And so- Here. Eat it ... you know, there's several things that, that influence the flavor- Yeah ... the quality of the soil, the variety of the cacao, how it was dr- fermented, how it was dried, how it was roasted, how it was ground down and for how long, and so you see this variety. Mm. Totally different. I, I wouldn't have placed it, like, as from the same plant. Mm-mm. Same Chuncho beans. Same beans, yeah. Yeah. Mm-mm. But it's, it's really s- This one is, like, tastes darker, a little bit more bitter, the larger squares. So the other one is a little sweeter A little- I'll, I'll have to try that one. I haven't tried- It has a fruity, fruity undertone to it. Yeah, so, um, no country has a flavor. I, I mean, a lot of people say to me, "Oh, I love Ecuadorian chocolate," and that's great, but Ecuador's a big place, and there's a lot of farms, and there's no one terroir, just like there's not a t- one terroir for wine. That being said, Peru does tend to have pretty fruity chocolate. Ah. And I used to hate- So it depends upon the region, too. Yeah. Mm. That's funny. They're a bit similar, 'cause I know the other one really well, but- Yep ... it's very grapey and winey- So- ... for me ... again, right? It has a- It's kinda grapey and winey ... yeah- Mm-hmm fruity undertone. So that being said, if somebody's going out into the market to buy chocolate, just the higher the cacao con- content, the better- Mm-hmm ... right? Yeah, I mean, like- If you were to give our listeners, like, you know, two tips when they go out to buy chocolate to make sure that the chocolate is healthier version of the chocolate, what should they look for? I would only go to craft chocolate shops. Oh. I wouldn't get it at the gro- That's key. I wouldn't get it- Okay ... I wouldn't get it at the grocery store because I can't- Go to craft chocolate shops Yeah Now you know it. Yeah, because industrial chocolate is just made differently. I, I mean, you know, a McDonald's hamburger is made for the masses. Yeah. It's made for price. It's not made for quality. Yes. It's the same with chocolate. Yeah. , And you've got somebody really skilled. If you've had a burger that's been, was cooked by somebody really skilled, the flavor's incredible. Yeah. When you have chocolate made by somebody who's skilled- It's incredible as well. Usually industrial chocolate, you're just burning it, you know- Yeah ... roasting it high, going through- It's mass production, right? It's mass production. Yeah. And mass production will never end. But that's a great tip. I think, a lot of people, even including me, we didn't, I didn't know about that. You gotta go to craft chocolate shops. Look up in your local area, "Who's my craft chocolate maker?" They're all over the country. It's, the craft chocolate movement started in the late n- like '90s, but there's most- there's a lot of craft chocolate shops all around. And if you visited them, they would love to just geek out and talk to you. I love that. I love that. Okay. We are gonna do that one of the days- ... in the city. Okay. I do want you to show your, Oh, book ... yeah. Yeah. Tell us a little bit about it, and then also tell us where can our listeners and viewers find out about you, if they wanna host, like, a workshop with you, how do they connect with you? So let's talk about the book first. The book, so I, uh, I taught preschool for a few years, and when I was traveling around to learn more about chocolate and visiting a lot of chocolate factories and shops, I saw there was no book for children zero to five. Ah. And I thought, "Yeah, but why would you write it?" But then I just kept having this feeling, I gotta write it. So, I got an illustrator in Mexico. She was actually just picked to do the World Cup poster. Oh, nice. Yeah, yeah. She, she's amazing. Wonderful. That is amazing. She's, yeah, she's amazing. Her n- yeah, she's amazing. So my, I'm currently doing rebranding, but my, I love that yeah, I'm thechocolate_connection on Instagram. Okay. And I have months, I have activities every month in New York City. At, I have, yeah, I have activities every month in New York City. I have a lot coming up. We're gonna be eating chocolate in gardens. I'm gonna do a hands-on history class. I love that which is very fun. So yeah, the chocolate_connection, and then my books are sold on my website, smallbatcheducation.com. I love that. In the show notes, I'm, I'm gonna include your Instagram handle, and I'm gonna include the link to your book- Great ... where it's sold. So yeah, just follow her @chocolate_connection to know where all the happenings are. This has been so awesome, Netty. Thanks for sharing this delicious chocolate with us. I really love them, and I think it's such a special treat to hear the story of how cacao is harvested, transported, and transformed into now what we know is like the wonder of chocolate, right? And thanks for sharing its science, flavor, and art. So thank you so much for sharing all this goodness. Thank you. Thanks for being on the podcast. Thank you. Yeah, thank you so much. Thank you so much, guys, for listening to us today. I hope you enjoyed this conversation. A quick disclaimer for you guys, the views expressed in this podcast are personal opinions and for educational purposes only. They are not intended to diagnose, treat, or act as medical advice. So if you have anything going on, please consult your physician for personalized health concerns. Thank you again for listening to us. Bye for now.